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4WHA-Back-in-NHL

Let’s start over by burying the hatchet

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HYMH, but you need something to show people that Hartford wants a team. 200 members of the HWBC isn't going to do it. You have to show that this area can support, and will support a team, wether it's NHL or AHL. 4K people at an AHL game doesn't look promising. Also the division amongst the fans in this area doesn't help either.

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We are forgetting we had a team that did very well when they were competitive.. It's **nne because attendance wasn't the reason the whalers left in the first place. When it came down to it and the fans had to put up they did, remember the season ticket drive that karmanoos put into place for the 97 season...

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MarkH2919 wrote :

> The Carolina Hurricanes, in their 12 years in Raleigh (no, I'm not counting

> the 2 years in Greensboro), the Hurricanes have had exactly ONE season

> where they have averaged 90%+ capacity, that coming in 2006/07, the season

> after they won the Stanley Cup. Before that, they never had a season in

> Raleigh where they averaged higher than 83% capacity. My point is it has

> taken quite a while, almost a whole decade if you include the 2 years in

> Greensboro, before the Canes really found their niche in the Triangle. My

> point is...it took success, far greater than any success they had in their

> time in Hartford, to get people into their building down there.

 

Your right it did. However, right off the bat the Canes averaged higher attendance numbers then the Whalers usually did, as soon as their third season they averaged higher attendance then Boston, Winnipeg, and the Islanders (Im not counting their Greensboro years because the arena was an hour and a half from Raleigh)

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UCHuskies wrote: “You do realize the NHL has to approve of a team relocating to Hartford (or any city) first right? No matter how much money baldwin finds in his couch, the NHL WONT allow a team to come here unless the market has proven it can support one.”

 

The same way Atlanta proved it should get a second NHL team? The way Miami proved it should get a first?

 

If Howard Baldwin or another owner had both the required **nding, & an arena deal that satisfied the NHL, they’d absolutely let the NHL back in Hartford regardless of what the Wolf * Pack averaged here. It’d be voted against by the Rangers & Bruins, but that wouldn’t be enough to keep Hartford out of the league.

 

UCHuskies wrote: “Along with it being the only NHL team in a 3 state radius, the Raleigh-Durham area had 50 years worth of sellout college basketball and football games for 3 major institutions (Duke, UNC, NC State) to prove it could support a team.”

 

Yes, the only NHL team in the Carolinas; which is like holding the Iditarod in Phoenix & touting it as the only snow dog race in the southwest.

 

Raleigh-Durham has indeed shown that they can support basketball & football. Fyi, basketball & football are not hockey. Alabama has shown that they really, really support Crimson Tide football. Perhaps Alabama should get an NHL team.

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"Your right it did. However, right off the bat the Canes averaged higher attendance numbers then the Whalers usually did, as soon as their third season they averaged higher attendance then Boston, Winnipeg, and the Islanders (Im not counting their Greensboro years because the arena was an hour and a half from Raleigh)"

 

Well...not really. The first year in Raleigh, they averaged 12,400/game, and 13,355 their second. It wasn't until 2001/02 (went to the Finals, lost to Detroit) before things picked up.

 

People forget, the Whalers throughout their existence here (for mostly terrible teams) averaged about 12,500/game

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"If Howard Baldwin or another owner had both the required **nding, & an arena deal that satisfied the NHL, they’d absolutely let the NHL back in Hartford regardless of what the Wolf * Pack averaged here. It’d be voted against by the Rangers & Bruins, but that wouldn’t be enough to keep Hartford out of the league."

 

Truth be told, I don't think there would be any resistence at all...the Bruins owner Jeremy Jacobs has gone on record saying that he'd vote Hartford back into the league to save on travel costs (and I'd guess the Rangers would do the same)

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MarkH2919 wrote :

> "If Howard Baldwin or another owner had both the required **nding,

> & an arena deal that satisfied the NHL, they’d absolutely let the NHL

> back in Hartford regardless of what the Wolf * Pack averaged here. It’d be

> voted against by the Rangers & Bruins, but that wouldn’t be enough to

> keep Hartford out of the league."

>

> Truth be told, I don't think there would be any resistence at all...the

> Bruins owner Jeremy Jacobs has gone on record saying that he'd vote

> Hartford back into the league to save on travel costs (and I'd guess the

> Rangers would do the same)

 

They may or may not, but either way it wouldn't be enough to keep Hartford out of the NHL. What's amazing is the few people that think AHL attendance means anything in the process of getting the NHL.

 

Mark can you imagine what the attendance here would've been if the Whalers had actually been even just plain good for any length of time?

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They look at the numbers. Numbers aren't a main reason for a team to move, but it's at least something that can make them decided on where to go. The only reason Philadelphia picked Adirondack (Glens Falls) is because they had great attendance for the AHL over the years.Why else would they move the team almost 300 miles away to a building that only holds about 5,000 people? NHL teams do look at AHL numbers for there own purposes. The Hurricanes had the River Rats play games there to see if that would be a great place to move their AHL affiliate, before the owners of the Charlotte Checkers said they wanted to move the team from the ECHL to the AHL. That's why the Checkers were able to come into the AHL. Their average attendance was around 5K for about 16 years. They are now averaging around 6,500. You may not think it matters, but a lot of people look at those numbers.

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Biggie1083 wrote :

The Hurricanes had the River Rats play games there to see if that would be a

> great place to move their AHL affiliate, before the owners of the Charlotte

> Checkers said they wanted to move the team from the ECHL to the AHL. That's

> why the Checkers were able to come into the AHL. Their average attendance

> was around 5K for about 16 years. They are now averaging around 6,500. You

> may not think it matters, but a lot of people look at those numbers.

 

If Hartford got an NHL team & put their AHL affiliate in Springfield, Springfield's attendance would go up, too.

 

Biggie, where an NHL team chooses to put their AHL team is not the same as where a rich owner from a certain area wants to put his (or her) NHL team.

 

Do you want to raise the AHL attendance in Hartford? Replace the Rangers. We all seem to discuss four primary fan bases here:

 

Group 1. Hartford AHL & NHL hockey fans who don't like the Rangers & won't go until they're gone, but will go see the AHL when they do leave

 

Group 2. Hockey fans who couldn't care less if it's AHL or NHL & will go regardless of who the affiliate is- Rangers or Whomever

 

Group 3. Whalers fans who only want to see NHL hockey here

 

Group 4. Rangers fans who only care about Hartford hockey so long as the Rangers are the affiliate & won't go at all, or only minimally, otherwise

 

If we can agree on this, let's go on. Group 4 above is by far the smallest group, so logically they should be the least catered to. Replace the Rangers & now you'll have Groups 1 & 2 going to games here. **rther, if a new affiliate brings most of the fans together & it starts working, you can likely *****ume that at least some fans from Group 3 will start attending to see what it's all about.

Edited by Guest

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For me personally, I just don't understand how some Whalers fans can't even respect what this team has done. They've made the playoffs 14 out of 15 years, they won the Calder Cup in 2000, and they even carried on the community relations that the Whalers started. BUT, since they are an AHL team, or that they are affiliated with the Rangers, it doesn't mean a damn thing. Some don't even consider the Wolf Pack/Whale a part of Hartford Hockey.

 

If, or when, the Rangers leave, we could have a team equal or better, or a team that is the worse team in the league, or a team like Springfield that can't keep an affiliate for more than 2-3 years. We don't know what might happen. The main problem, as I see it is, Whalers fans can't be happy with what we have. What we've had is one of the best AHL teams for the past 15 years. I can understand the feeling of loss, and I'm not telling anyone to "get over it", but way can't people just go and have **n?

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Biggie1083 wrote :

> For me personally, I just don't understand how some Whalers fans can't even

> respect what this team has done. They've made the playoffs 14 out of 15

> years, they won the Calder Cup in 2000, and they even carried on the

> community relations that the Whalers started. BUT, since they are an AHL

> team, or that they are affiliated with the Rangers, it doesn't mean a damn

> thing. Some don't even consider the Wolf Pack/Whale a part of Hartford

> Hockey.

>

> If, or when, the Rangers leave, we could have a team equal or better, or a

> team that is the worse team in the league, or a team like Springfield that

> can't keep an affiliate for more than 2-3 years. We don't know what might

> happen. The main problem, as I see it is, Whalers fans can't be happy with

> what we have. What we've had is one of the best AHL teams for the past 15

> years. I can understand the feeling of loss, and I'm not telling anyone to

> "get over it", but way can't people just go and have **n?

 

You can't understand it Biggie because you always, always look at things from the perspective of a Rangers fan. You seem like a decent enough guy, so I'll write this again. It doesn't matter how much they win if you can't stand them & are rooting for them to lose. How can you respect an organization that disrespects your hometown & its history?

 

Another thing I'll repeat is that the Rangers aren't trying to put a winner on the ice for Hartford; they're doing it for themselves. I'd take multiple affiliations over many years that aren't the Rangers because I could root for them, whether or not they made the playoffs.

 

The AHL playoffs are easier to make than a ham sandwich anyway and besides, the Wolf * Pack/Whale haven't done anything in the playoffs for a dozen years.

Edited by Guest

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Biggie1083 wrote:

> For me personally, I just don't understand how some Whalers fans can't even

> respect what this team has done. They've made the playoffs 14 out of 15

> years, they won the Calder Cup in 2000

 

 

^^^ As usual, I agree with the sentiments expressed by Biggie, he speaks the truth about the hockey situation in Hartford. Also Biggie, the reason why Whalers fans are so disrespect**l and angry is they are JEALOUS of what the Wolf Pack accomplished, the Wolf Pack accomplished more in their first 5 years than the Whalers ever accomplished. It was the Wolf Pack who brought the only professional championship to Hartford, while the Whalers were busy making the headlines in the Courant for players arrested for drunk driving and bar fights. Biggie, as usual, I have your back, if I was present the day when some spineless Whalers fan made disparaging remarks to your sister, that Whalers fan would have lost at least a few teeth, I have no time for these bottom-feeding Whalers fans who are stuck in 1980, they need to face the facts that their team is gone, their team is not coming back, their team moved to another state and won a Stanley Cup in that other state, and they need to stop living off of grainy VHS tapes from 1982 with Mike Rogers p*****ing a pixelated puck around. The worst part are the Whalers boosters, most of them are so old they are probably retired, why can't they just retire down south so they can attend Whalers/Hurricane games again, why do Whalers Boosters stir up trouble here in Hartford when their team is playing in N. Carolina, I am sure they can find somewhere to move to in N. Carolina, if they can't afford a house then buy an old Chevy conversion van and park it in the woods and drive to the games, but leave us alone up here in Hartford, we're sick of the senior citizens with their blue/green hats trying to tell us about the glory days of Whaler hockey when it was the Wolf Pack who brought the only sports championship to Hartford.

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I don't need you to back me up. I don't want anyone that turns his back on a team he supported for years, just because they changed their name. You are one of the problems. You say you love the Wolf Pack, but you are boycotting the Wolf Pack. The sooner you realize that the better. The Wolf Pack is the Whale, the Whale is Wolf Pack, and they are both a part of Hartford Hockey.

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Again your stupidity is overwhelming..but you are right after 5 years they have been a total waste.. And let's not forget when the pack first moved on to Hartford whaler territory we whaler fans supported them, after we realized the rangers and aeg had no interest in bringing back real professional hockey most of them left..we may have not won a stanley cup, but we were true fans, unlike your one person worm movement.. Hope**lly, and only because of people like yourself, will feel the pain as well when the rangers finally ship out.. Hartford will once again shine in the NHL,and you will be lost forever

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"The only reason Philadelphia picked Adirondack (Glens Falls) is because they had great attendance for the AHL over the years.Why else would they move the team almost 300 miles away to a building that only holds about 5,000 people?"

 

There also weren't a lot of places to pick from. Remember, the Phantoms were basically kicked out of the Spectrum because the powers that be decided to demolish the arena for some entertainment district.

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"Mark can you imagine what the attendance here would've been if the Whalers had actually been even just plain good for any length of time?"

 

This is an outstanding point, one that is so conveniently missed by most people. The Whalers went through 2 periods, from 1980-1983 and from 1991-1994 where they were just plain aw**l. Yes, they made the playoffs and took the Canadiens to 7 games in 1992, but they were not very good, 26-41-13. The two seasons after that were worse. When the Whalers were competitive...not necessarily good...but just competitive...they averaged well over 80% capacity, with a few years in the 90%+ capacity range.

 

We Whalers fans never asked for the moon and the stars. All we asked was the team to be competitive year in and year out. When they were, we supported them in droves.

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Guys, gals, wolfpack fans,

 

Its simple, find your reason to go and actually go.

 

Miss the Whalers and want to reminisce? Go to a whale game and reminisce.

 

Hate the whale, love the wolfpack? Go to whale game and root against them.

 

Love the whale, hate the wolf pack? Run down a wolfpack fan as they cross the street then park and go to a whale game.

 

Whether it is hate or love you feel in your heart, the answer is hockey (con**cious).

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4WHA it's about 15 years too late to bury anything, it's not N.Y. fault the Whalers left and quite frankly I don't care this rehashing of what happend, who dosen't care the New building, Baldwin is all BS.

Either you go or don't.in the end when Hockey totaly leaves and there is nothing but a few more tumbleweeds rolling down main street then everyone will be happy.

 

And none of you still have figured out WP98 is just amping you all up, he still goes to games but since most of you are not the brightest bulbs in the pack and can't see through his BS. I'm glad I don't sit next to you I can only imagine the witty banter you would bring.

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Blubber maybe weblike the fact that wp98 Amos is up, he looks like the stupid one, and and you do to.. Baldwin is not bs, he had a plan to bring the NHL back and was on his way to doing it, that's a fact.. As far as tumbleweeds, only in you and wf98 brains.. You guys give the more reason to get the rangers out of here and aeg with htem

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Biggie1083 wrote :

> I don't think it will ever happen. You are always going to have the

> anti-Rangers, for one reason or another, and the anti-AHL people. Even if

> the Rangers leave, you will still have the anti-AHL people. People on here

> say the are Hartford Hockey fans, but say they won't support the team that

> is playing in Hartford. There aren't a lot of Hartford Hockey fans, but

> there are a lot of Whalers only fans, Wolf Pack/Whale only fans, and other

> "I will only go if it's this way" fans.

 

 

Agreed Biggie.

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Biggie1083 wrote :

> HYMH, but you need something to show people that Hartford wants a team. 200

> members of the HWBC isn't going to do it. You have to show that this area

> can support, and will support a team, wether it's NHL or AHL. 4K people at

> an AHL game doesn't look promising. Also the division amongst the fans in

> this area doesn't help either.

 

Yup, I agree **lly Biggie. That's why the NHL will never return.

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Biggie1083 wrote :

> For me personally, I just don't understand how some Whalers fans can't even

> respect what this team has done. They've made the playoffs 14 out of 15

> years, they won the Calder Cup in 2000, and they even carried on the

> community relations that the Whalers started. BUT, since they are an AHL

> team, or that they are affiliated with the Rangers, it doesn't mean a damn

> thing. Some don't even consider the Wolf Pack/Whale a part of Hartford

> Hockey.

>

> If, or when, the Rangers leave, we could have a team equal or better, or a

> team that is the worse team in the league, or a team like Springfield that

> can't keep an affiliate for more than 2-3 years. We don't know what might

> happen. The main problem, as I see it is, Whalers fans can't be happy with

> what we have. What we've had is one of the best AHL teams for the past 15

> years. I can understand the feeling of loss, and I'm not telling anyone to

> "get over it", but way can't people just go and have **n?

 

Exactly, its absurd. Enjoy not having the NHL here ever again. :mrgreen:

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